New Greco rules have been written up and out for approval

New Greco rules have been written up and out for approval

Postby olddirty » Sun Mar 10, 2013 3:37 pm

Basically they are this:

2-3 minute periods with aggragate scoring
10 points is a tech
pushout 1
takedown 2
feet to back 4
high amplitude throw 5
passivity is back
all turns are now 2. no hand to hand 1's. lift to back exposure is still 3 or 5
if it is tied at the break, they go to par terre. in par terre, you START with the lock on top (reverse or gut), then the bottom guy bases out, then the ref blows the whistle.
User avatar
olddirty
Gold Member
Gold Member
 
Posts: 4705
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby TripNSweep » Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:45 pm

I like it.
Ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls. Contrary to what you've just seen, war is neither glamorous nor fun. There are no winners, only losers. There are no good wars, with the following exceptions: The American Revolution, World War II, and the Star Wars Trilogy. If you'd like to learn more about war, there's lots of books in your local library, many of them with cool, gory pictures.
TripNSweep
Gold Member
Gold Member
 
Posts: 6273
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm
Location: Charlotte Amalie, St. Thomas, USVI

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby gutfirst » Sun Mar 10, 2013 5:49 pm

thanks for the update od.

sounds good. how is the par terre/clinch determined at the end of period 1? great idea about starting position, lock drop then start. should be more fair than locking in par terre.

not sure about 4 points for feet to back from nuetral and 3 for feet to back from par terre?
gutfirst
Silver Member
Silver Member
 
Posts: 1883
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm
Location: nj

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby Old_Marine_Wrestler » Sun Mar 10, 2013 6:02 pm

od - with these possible new rules do they get rid of the contact at the beginning of each period that was instituted last year?
Old_Marine_Wrestler
Gold Member
Gold Member
 
Posts: 2758
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby fadzaev2 » Sun Mar 10, 2013 6:30 pm

Now let's take the FS rules back to when they were at their best!!
User avatar
fadzaev2
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 906
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

New Greco rules have been written up and out for approval

Postby Matburn155 » Sun Mar 10, 2013 7:02 pm

BIG improvement! Hopefully FS will "take it back" in time as well!
Matburn155
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 922
Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 8:16 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby Plasmodium » Sun Mar 10, 2013 8:18 pm

Cumulative scoring bites. These are going to be 5 minute snooze fests.
Plasmodium
Gold Member
Gold Member
 
Posts: 2071
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby DaveNYC » Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:07 pm

Now we're getting somewhere. Cumulative scoring is the way to go. And it won't be a snooze fest with a forced par terre as a tie breaker in the 2nd period starting in the locked position.
This is great news.
DaveNYC
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:07 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby quanon » Sun Mar 10, 2013 9:20 pm

Assuming this passes, my guess is that instead of seeing one minute of inaction on the feet, we would see three minutes of inaction. Then the forced hold, then another minute or two of inaction. Then some wrestling. I hope I'm wrong.
quanon
Silver Member
Silver Member
 
Posts: 1982
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:15 am

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby DaveNYC » Sun Mar 10, 2013 10:22 pm

The forced hold in par terre almost guarantees the wrestler on top gets a turn or a throw. If you want to avoid being turned or thrown, then you would initiate scoring opportunities in the 1st period. Passivity has also been reinstated, as well as 2 points for a takedown, as opposed to a push out and takedown being scored the same.
It's still much better than what passed for Greco in London. At least they're trying, and trying in the right direction.
DaveNYC
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 8:07 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby quanon » Sun Mar 10, 2013 10:47 pm

DaveNYC wrote:Passivity has also been reinstated

This is the key. If passivity is back, it changes everything.
quanon
Silver Member
Silver Member
 
Posts: 1982
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:15 am

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby oldrules » Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:43 pm

Holy ****! I hope this is true and not some early april fools joke. It is about time they put the wrestling back in wrestling. Now do the same to freestyle, give us our weight classes back and send a russian hit squad after the ioc board.
I spoke too soon and fila still found a way to fark it up some more
oldrules
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 288
Joined: Tue May 01, 2012 1:17 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby SetonHallPirate » Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:51 pm

"Captain rearranges deck chairs, declares course safe."

An improvement, but rule changes alone aren't going to save us.
Owner/Operator of the Dual Impact Index presented by the National Collegiate Open
Follow me on Twitter @WrestlingSHP
Heard on Press Row: "Pirate, you would never get called for stalling." True, but all of my shots get countered straight to my back...
SetonHallPirate
Gold Member
Gold Member
 
Posts: 8525
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby olddirty » Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:56 pm

No forced chest to chest starts anymore. Also, there is passivity, and if it is 0-0 at break, someone gets a full on lock. I would bet less than 10% of matches even go to a 0-0 break, just based on how big of a penalty it will be. I was by no means the best in the world, but I could turn world and Olympic champs if we started with a lock.
User avatar
olddirty
Gold Member
Gold Member
 
Posts: 4705
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby quanon » Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:01 am

olddirty wrote:No forced chest to chest starts anymore. Also, there is passivity, and if it is 0-0 at break, someone gets a full on lock. I would bet less than 10% of matches even go to a 0-0 break, just based on how big of a penalty it will be. I was by no means the best in the world, but I could turn world and Olympic champs if we started with a lock.

The freestyle clinch was a decisive penalty as well, and there were years at worlds where 40% of the medal matches went to the clinch. If passivity gets enforced like it was years ago, it shouldn't matter, though.
quanon
Silver Member
Silver Member
 
Posts: 1982
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:15 am

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby XIVCoach » Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:15 am

Wow, they are getting it! This is a great rule set, best of the best from over the years. The one thing I don't like is passivity coming back. If you have the push out rule, passivity becomes less important imho. Greco could be fun again!
XIVCoach
Silver Member
Silver Member
 
Posts: 1527
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby wnywrestling » Mon Mar 11, 2013 8:36 am

How do they decide who gets the par terre lock? It seems like there should be a third period and both wrestlers should get the opportunity to start in that position.

I hope they don't copy these exact rules, times, weight classes, etc. and use them for freestyle. I think the sports need to be more different. For instance, perhaps keep 7 weight classes for Greco but increase freestyle back to 10. If they're worried about giving out too many medals, then stop giving out 2 bronze medals at every weight.
Last edited by wnywrestling on Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:52 am, edited 2 times in total.
wnywrestling
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 184
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 10:11 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby Jaguar » Mon Mar 11, 2013 9:19 am

I would also rather not see passivity back, as that is one of the areas where biased refereeing occurred, which was one of the "evils" the new rules attempted to address.

How about if the push meant no points by forced par terre?
User avatar
Jaguar
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 833
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby GoNotQuietly » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:00 pm

olddirty wrote:Basically they are this:

2-3 minute periods with aggragate scoring
10 points is a tech
pushout 1
takedown 2
feet to back 4
high amplitude throw 5
passivity is back
all turns are now 2. no hand to hand 1's. lift to back exposure is still 3 or 5
if it is tied at the break, they go to par terre. in par terre, you START with the lock on top (reverse or gut), then the bottom guy bases out, then the ref blows the whistle.


Awesome rules, we had a thread that made almost all of these suggestions. I heard that you need to be attempting a hold to achieve the push-out pt now (no accidental step-outs)...can anyone confirm?
GoNotQuietly
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 115
Joined: Wed Feb 13, 2013 2:18 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby Ching » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:19 pm

This would have been a great step in 2005/6 instead of throwing the baby out with the bathwater.
User avatar
Ching
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 108
Joined: Mon Dec 06, 2010 2:41 pm


Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby Ray_Brinzer » Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:11 pm

Jaguar wrote:I would also rather not see passivity back, as that is one of the areas where biased refereeing occurred, which was one of the "evils" the new rules attempted to address.


While I am sympathetic to what the soon-to-be-old new rules tried to accomplish, I imagine "We have to do it like this, because we can't control the rampant corruption amongst our referees" wouldn't play all that well in a presentation to the IOC.
Ray_Brinzer
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 315
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby Ray_Brinzer » Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:25 pm

olddirty wrote:Basically they are this:
10 points is a tech
pushout 1
takedown 2
feet to back 4
high amplitude throw 5
passivity is back
all turns are now 2. no hand to hand 1's. lift to back exposure is still 3 or 5


The one thing which jumps out at me, here: if feet-to-back is 4, 5 for a high-amplitude throw isn't enough. There's too little incentive to attempt a big throw, rather than a modest one.

I'm almost inclined to wish they'd make it:

100 points is a tech
pushout 10
takedown 20
feet to back 40
high amplitude throw 50
passivity is back
all turns are now 20. no hand to hand 10's. lift to back exposure is still 30 or 50

Which would provide a long-term solution to the problem of having too coarse a scoring system. One of the reasons escapes never really worked in FS/GR, because they were worth the same as a takedown, which doesn't work well. But you couldn't make it lower without reworking the scoring system, or going outside the integers.

Almost inclined. Bigger numbers might be too weird for a lot of people. They might be too weird for me, for that matter. Or maybe we'd get used to them.

Overall, though, the new new rules look cool and fan-friendly. Maybe they're scared enough to crack down on corruption, and passivity will work for awhile.
Ray_Brinzer
Bronze Member
Bronze Member
 
Posts: 315
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 12:40 pm

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby hannurapa » Mon Mar 11, 2013 9:25 pm

Where have the new rules been posted? Have not seen anything yet outside of this forum.
hannurapa
 
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Mar 08, 2013 10:52 am

Re: New Greco rules have been written up and out for approva

Postby quanon » Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:17 pm

Those are just the suggestions from the United States Greco guys.
quanon
Silver Member
Silver Member
 
Posts: 1982
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 10:15 am

Next

Return to International Wrestling

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Angry_Fish, AnklePicker, Ari Gold, cwillaert, Jason_L._Jackson, josefsmoe, meloserio and 53 guests